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...huh? this was last year. it's not decided on yet, mainly because they have yet to provide a definition of "honest living". the only news from this week was that they want it to work retroactively, which basically every lawyer instantly struck down. it could make it fail even harder.
Edit: nevermind it being from this week, state media reported on it at the end of january. the term for look up, for those interested, is the swedish for "non-honest living": "bristande vandel"
Goes into effect in July according to the article.
the article is wrong, it's not been debated yet. it's been put forward by the government but hasn't passed the riksdag. it's expected to go into effect in july because new laws in sweden always go into effect in january or july.
Edit: also note that the bill runs contrary to the findings of the committee formed to investigate the possibility, which means support will not be unanimous within the government coalition.
It has plenty of time to pass, the new citizenship laws are also slated to start going into effect on national day (June 6th) even though they've not passed yet. Passing the Riksdag ia a formality when the government has a majority.
which means support will not be unanimous within the government coalition.
Wrong conclusion if you ask me.
you think? there's been a lot of noise from inside the tidö team. i'm not sure they can put up a united front.
I think they would've postponed it until after the elections like they've done with taking back permanent residencies if they were not all behind it. DN says "Regeringen går vidare med förslaget om vandelsprövning för uppehållstillstånd", which is why this is in the news again, it's very unlikely that at this stage a party backs out.
i was assuming that they are trying to rush it through because they think it will win them more seats, but what with L disintegrating in real time i don't think it matters either way.
Good that they are no longer turning a blind eye to those who abuse the system. It's really infuriating to migrants who are just normal residents and citizens.
Why should they "turn a blind eye" to non-migrants who do not follow an "honest living"?
They shouldn't. With regards non-migrants who only have Swedish citizenship deportation isn't an option, but jail or fines presumably is.
Why isn't deportation an option?
I'll have to speak in general terms because I cant know every specific scenario.
What purpose would deportation of a citizen serve? One of the defining things about citizenship is the right to live in the place you have citizenship. Typically countries cannot leave persons stateless so deportation would be pointless, at most they pay for an air fare back, assuming there's somewhere you can deport them to.
You're right, fines should be levied equally if that's the appropriate punishment. Putting someone in jail is expensive, it would seem counter to the point if the punishment for "abusing the system" was to further extract funds from the system to pay for someone's housing and food would it not?
One of the defining things about citizenship is the right to live in the place you have citizenship.
This one is interesting, because they are proposing to revoke the citizenship and deport them.
assuming there's somewhere you can deport them to.
Tom Hanks has tried to leave the chat but is stuck living in the airport terminal.
What purpose would deportation of a citizen serve?
Presumably the same purpose (if any) the deportation of a noncitizen would serve.
One of the defining things about citizenship is the right to live in the place you have citizenship. Typically countries cannot leave persons stateless so deportation would be pointless, at most they pay for an air fare back, assuming there’s somewhere you can deport them to.
You’re right, fines should be levied equally if that’s the appropriate punishment. Putting someone in jail is expensive, it would seem counter to the point if the punishment for “abusing the system” was to further extract funds from the system to pay for someone’s housing and food would it not?
So why not take away those rights of citizens, if deportation is so beneficial?
Presumably the same purpose (if any) the deportation of a noncitizen would serve.
Well, no, because citizens have the right to reside, non citizens don't. As mentioned previously citizen can just rock up to the border and re-enter.
So why not take away those rights of citizens,
Take away citizenship rights? That would create a stateless person. Even if we ignore the fact most countries can't or won't do that you've now got a scenario where the person you want to deport has no right to reside anywhere.
So when you show up with a plane full of ex Swedes at some airport the receiving country will go "oh those people have no right to be here, entry denied." At which point you can either take them back to Sweden or leave them on the runway. I'd imagine it wouldn't take long for most countries to deny entry to any transport leaving Sweden.
if deportation is so beneficial
I don't believe I've said it was beneficial at all.
To be fair, prisons in Europe are about rehabilitation and not punishment. Why should Swedish taxpayers pay for the rehabilitation of a non-swede?
Why should Swedish taxpayers pay for the rehabilitation of a Swede?
Why wouldn't they? That's like asking why would they pay for their fellow citizens healthcare.
You're almost starting to get it.
How on earth did you glean that from the article?
I didn't; I gleaned it from your comment and your seeming endorsement of this double standard.
“If, for example, you ignore paying your debts, if you don’t comply with decisions from Swedish authorities, if you cheat the benefits system, if you cheat your way to a Swedish residence permit... then you do not have the right to be here,” Forssell said.
Other examples the government cited as examples included working without paying taxes or not paying fines.
"Just don't be poor."
“Statements -- that is, things a person says or expresses -- should not in themselves be regarded as evidence of lack of honest living, but they may be an indication of, for example, links to violent extremism, which can then be a sign of deficient character,” Ludvig Aspling, migration policy spokesman for the anti-immigration Sweden Democrats which is propping up the government, told reporters.
Absolutely dystopian.
Nah man, I'm poor as fuck right now, I barely make minimum wage, but I properly file my taxes and you know what? Because the system in my country is good, I don't have to break the bank to do so either.
Fraud, debt evasion, tax evasion etc are not a consequence of poverty and instead do affect all other people who do things right. You can't benefit from tax money and from the system if you're actively cheating it.
Fraud, debt evasion, tax evasion etc are not a consequence of poverty
Except poverty is the single best predictor for crime. Also laws like these can be and are used in combination with purposely obtuse laws and bureaucratic barriers to harass immigrants who didn't do anything wrong. The debts thing in particular reminds me of Japan, where paying a bill late for any reason (even if it's not your fault) can be used as reason to deny PR and give shorter visas. You should question the motivations of politicians more.
Isn't extraordinary wealth the single best predictor for crime?
No, because the wealthy write the law.
See corruption: a lot of stuff the wealthy do can be identified instinctively as morally wrong or corrupt. But, alas, it is often found to be perfectly legal ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Book recommendation: The Code of Capital - How the Law creates Wealth and Inequality
Please stop equating being poor with being fraudulent and criminal. The list of fraudulent behavior has nothing to do with being poor.
And fighting violent extremism is in no way dystopian.
"The law in its majestic equality forbids both the poor and the rich from sleeping under bridges, beg in the streets and steal loaves of bread."
- Anatole France
In the Netherlands, there was a massive scandal a few years back where the government had declared thousands of migrants to be fraudulent based on an automated system that used their ethnicity as sufficient cause, driving those people into debt and forcing many to work illegally to avoid homelessness.
Please develop some class consciousness. They will come for you too when the exploitation of those below you no longer satisfies their lust for power.
These guys are not in any way stopping att violent extremism.
The guy on the photo, Johan Forssell, had advocated - and slammed on social media - that we should send home entire families based on a single individuals crime. Yet when his own son was found to be part of a violent nazi organisation it was handled like a case of boys will be boys. He's constantly generalising over immigrants and yet he's only part of the conservative party that have been paving the way, openly, for the party that started as a nazi party in the 90s, in order to get to power.
These changes might look harmless but these fucks are just power hungry sell-outs that have decided that nazis are fit to rule if it allows themselves to stay mildly relevant.
There is no current definition of honest living and everyone from the ruling parties that was asked about it have answered wildly different.
And fighting violent extremism is in no way dystopian.
Violent extremism like checks notes opposing Israeli colonialism. See: Germany.
Last time I was in Germany, I saw tons of that anti colonial opposition. They were not violent.
And fighting violent extremism is in no way dystopian.
Sweden going to cut ties with the USA, then?
Poor people have a smaller tax burden for their socialized healthcare. "Don't pay taxes" isn't a "poor" thing.