this post was submitted on 23 Oct 2025

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geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml

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The EU wants to steal Russian money and give it to Ukraine. How is that supposed to work? (swentr.site)

submitted 5 months ago by bubblybubbles@lemmy.ml to c/europe@lemmy.ml

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[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml -3 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Do you think you can invade a sovereign nation without there being consequences?

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Yes look at Israel

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml 8 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I hope Israel will get their consequences too

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It won't.

Also Russia is not getting sanctions, the EU is stealing their money.

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml -2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

How would you say EU are stealing their money?

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 6 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Russia had investments and other assets in the EU. First the EU froze their assets, which in itself is a dangerous move because it claims ownership over anothers investments. Now the EU is selling those assets and giving the money to Ukraine. This is directly stealing money from Russia.

If you buy S&P500 stocks and the US decides to "confiscate your assets to give to Donald Trump" then effectively you have been robbed.

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml -2 points 5 months ago (3 children)

Do you call it stealing when the police takes your money after you've got pulled over for speeding as well? Or, to more accurately mirror Russia's actions, drive into someone else's yard killing and abducting the residents

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

There is a well known and clear agreement that if I speed I pay a fine. There are also cases of cops "confiscating" people's money which I would indeed classify as stealing.

The problem here is that Ukraine is not in the EU and Europe made up a punishment after Russia invaded Ukraine.

Trump too can make up things and sign them into law after you invested your money, giving him the "legal authority" to steal it, but he's still stealing your money, which is the example I'm giving.

[+] Deifyed@lemmy.ml -6 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Why do you bring up and compare to Trump? Trump is a monster, a bully and an asshole. I don't give a flying f about that guy. Both Russia and Trump can be bad

Russia has invaded, raped, killed and abducted. What ever they were entitled to should be forfeited until all the damage they have caused has been paid for both economically and emotionally. They had every chance to get their values back by just not continuing to invade Ukraine

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 4 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Do you understand what an example is?

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml -5 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It's a bad example since they can't be compared

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 5 points 5 months ago (2 children)

This is about people making up laws which didn't exist before to confiscate property. The EU did not have any laws about selling off Russian assets if they invaded Ukraine.

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml -4 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Might not be a law, but most people know that if you do bad shit, bad shit happens

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 6 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It doesn't for Israel.

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml -3 points 5 months ago (2 children)

And that is a shame. And I hope that changes. But it does not excuse Russia's actions

[–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 3 points 5 months ago

Europe actively and materially supports Israel

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 1 points 5 months ago

It doesn't excuse Russia's actions but it does invalidate Europe stealing Russia's money for any reason related to "international law" or "human rights".

[–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 4 points 5 months ago

That's never been the case for Europe, you rampage all over the world

[–] Scirocco@lemmy.world -5 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Do you have this same problem with the Nuremburg Trials?

Russia dun goofed in Ukraine.

They are already well into the Finding Out portion, and having their financial assets seized/frozen is only part of that

TBH I haven't read deeply into the details, but my understanding is that what's actually being taken/removed/paid from this accounts is only the gains/interest. They accounts are "frozen" meaning that their appreciation is frozen

the principal balance stays the same from the date of the freeze. However, the investments still produce income, and this is what's being seized. I think this is the typical format, and the process is not at all unique to Russia or the conflict that they started.

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 7 points 5 months ago (2 children)

It's in not comparable to Nuremberg. The problem here is the selective application. They aren't upholding any international order. Israel is doing the same and not even getting any sanctions. They are simply stealing money from their adversaries.

[–] Scirocco@lemmy.world -2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

It absolutely is comparable. Nuremburg was an EXTREMELY selective application.

Sometimes, a state/government/group takes actions that are so objectionable that other people want to punish them, and collectively they decide that it's okay to make up a new rule and apply it retroactively.

That was how Nuremburg happened, and now it has happened again. We can argue if it was justified or not, or about the details of implementation.

You may be salty that Israel appears to be getting away with its bad behavior, but the two things really are not connected

Russia has Fucked Up (by failing to achieve their SMO goals in three days) and then they have Doubled Down (by failing to quit while they were ahead) and now, of course as the kids do like to say, they are Finding Out. (a little bit at least)

Will it matter? Who knows?

But just today Lukoil agreed to sell off all of their overseas assets, and I'm guessing the buyers got a steal. This won't bring about regime change directly, but domestic politics in Russia are tense. Unanswered anti-putin protests in st Petersburg would have been unthinkable a year ago

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 3 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

What Israel is doing is objectively far worse than what Russia is doing.

[–] Scirocco@lemmy.world -2 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

That is an opinion that some people share.

I don't think they are easily compared. Different forms of the same general crime against humanity.

Both are pretty awful, but I'm not sure that it's a contest about which has a greater degree of awfulness.

I'd support similar economic treatment of Israel's overseas financial holdings though.

Wouldn't that be something to see! Haha it's fun to think about at least.

Israel not being held accountable for it's shitty behavior doesn't mean Russia should get a free pass

(Insert porque no los dos meme)

*Edited to expand initial reaction

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 3 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

Israel killed more women and children in two months than Russia did in two years. Which is even more impressive because Palestine is way smaller than Ukraine.

Russia makes less than 3% civilian casualties. Israel at least 80% and probably way more.

This doesn't make Russia's invasion good but at leas they're not intentionally massacring the entirity of Ukraine Holocaust style.

But yes if Europe sanctioned both then I wouldn't complain about it. The selective application is the problem.

[–] Scirocco@lemmy.world -2 points 5 months ago

Well, you certainly are allowed to be mad about the unfairness of it all

'Fair' is a figment of human imagination unfortunately, but it's one of our best dreams and I too wish all the things were fair.

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml -2 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Why is your argument "but they did it"? Ignore the others and be good. You should strive to be better

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 3 points 5 months ago

The argument is my username.

[–] Scirocco@lemmy.world 1 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

What are you even talking about? I think the point went over your head.

My point is that the Nuremburg Trials were also "made up" laws to apply retroactively to people who did some bad shit.

Sometimes, that's okay. In many folks' opinion at the time, and now, the Nuremburg Trials were a good idea.

There may credibly be arguments over whether Russia's behavior merits such exceptional treatment (obviously I believe it does)

Counter-whaddaboutism with regarding Israel's appalling bad behavior isn't relevant, but I would support similar treatment for them, except that is obviously not happening

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Sorry. Not sure what is going on. My reply wasn't to your comment. Having a hard time navigating this app

[–] Scirocco@lemmy.world 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Ah no worries.

If you're using Jeroba, I can empathize. If you're using some other quirky app, .. I guess they are all like that

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Was using eternity, but saw it hadn't been updated in 15 months. Switched to Voyager for now

[–] Scirocco@lemmy.world 1 points 5 months ago

My dearest wish would be a version of RiF for Lemmy

But the dev of that near-perfect app is focused on Tildes, which is a very good community, but a very different one than lemmy

[–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 2 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Trump is a monster, a bully and an asshole

So is the EU

Russia has invaded, raped, killed and abducted.

You mean like what the EU supports in Israel?

What ever they were entitled to should be forfeited until all the damage they have caused has been paid for

Then the EU should be giving all their assets away to the countless countries they've destroyed over the years, from the Congo to Iraq to Palestine. Oh but no, you're a bunch of hypocrites who want to enforce a law on others that you won't follow yourself.

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml 0 points 5 months ago

If it was up to me (and a whole lot of others) we would follow them. Our politicians have let our countries depend on other countries to such an extent that they get away with shit like that. It's sickening. That does not mean that I will stand idly by what Russia is doing. I will also be loud in opposition to what Israel is doing. Or any other atrocities happening. I want peace. I want people to be able to live without fear of bombs falling down on them. Or people shooting them. Whether it be Ukrainians, Palestinians or any other population. Fuck these fucking politicians man

[–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 4 points 5 months ago (1 children)

The EU is not the fucking world police. This is like some random guy pulling you over and taking your money.

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml 0 points 5 months ago (1 children)

If it was a killer in your neighborhood on the loose, would you respect his possessions?

[–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml -1 points 5 months ago

Yes. Especially if I was a prolific killer myself, as Europe is in the analogy.

[–] cfgaussian@lemmygrad.ml 1 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Neither the EU nor the US are the world's police. They have absolutely no right to unilaterally declare themselves the world's policeman. Only the UN has the right to impose sanctions.

[–] Deifyed@lemmy.ml 0 points 4 months ago

That is true. However, when someone is being really bad you do what you can to prevent it

[–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 0 points 5 months ago

Clearly, western countries, including many European ones, do it fairly often. Not to mention their ongoing support for Israel.