this post was submitted on 26 Aug 2026
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It's wild how many people seem to think that winning a revolution would somehow be easier than winning an election.

This is what I'm saying!! People keep being like "we can't possibly solve things through voting! That would involve massive organizing, getting everyone on the same page, making compromises and settling for less than perfection, and it would be subject to the influence of mega-wealthy donors and an opposition-controlled media environment! We just have to have a revolution so we don't have to deal with any of those things!"

And it's like. I'd be less annoyed about what are obviously people who are hurt and frustrated lashing out if they didn't act like I was a fucking fascist for saying "I don't think massive amounts of death and violence will help this situation, actually"

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[–] TreadOnMe@hexbear.net 4 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

They will never give you any of that, and a Republican will just be elected in the next cycle to turn back the clock twice as much.

If you push for actual Socialism (which Mamdani is not doing btw), and have any level of real success, they will not hesitate to use the power of the state to harass, imprison, or kill you, and if things get really dire for them, they will not hesitate to kill your friends, your family, and anyone you have ever loved regardless of if they had any knowledge of your action. And I am talking about the Democrats here, who will just sit back and let the Republicans do this to you.

You can either take this shit actually seriously, and understand what the real stakes are, or you can just wander through naively and assume that they are just as non-committal as you are. That said, it is possible to take this shit seriously and choose to do nothing or only work when there is something that can actually be gained. These are all rational choices. Just be aware of what the stakes actually are, and what, if you are advocating for Socialism, you are actually asking for. The truth doesn't have to drive you mad.

Not that you shouldn't vote. By all means do. Just don't expect anything substantial to actually come of it.

[–] MayoPete@hexbear.net 1 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

People who weren't running for office got killed for organizing. We're dead either way, so I don't buy that argument.

And I do read! I tried getting through What Is To Be Done and it was a slog that wasn't helpful in anyway. I'll give State and Revolution a chance. But also I have reservations about telling people to "just read theory":

  • We need people to learn the skills of organizing, how to talk to people and run meetings, etc. Theory doesn't teach this.

  • Most people aren't going to read, and if they do, they're not reading at the grade level needed to understand this stuff.

  • Telling others to read instead of being able to explain ourselves quickly makes us look like a bunch of dorks. Dorks don't win.

  • Theory is great to learn context and history behind major left events, but is not relevant today. Material conditions are different and we need Theory that reflects this. Let's not become Bible thumpers unable to adapt because we keep pushing the same set of readings.

  • By pushing Theory you are self-selecting for a small number of nerdy, bookworm type people to organize with. And I'll be blunt, those people aren't leading anything much less a revolution. We need people of all stripes from across the working class. We need to be accessible to someone who just pulled a double at Wendy's and asking them to read super dense history lessons isn't reaching that person.

[–] TreadOnMe@hexbear.net 1 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

You are probably responding to the wrong person.

Correct. They will kill you anyways, so make sure what you are doing will actually do something, because their attention will be on you no matter your level of action.

I did not tell you to read anything. Reading historical theory really only matters if you are already committed to some sort of praxis. If you are not committed to praxis, all that reading theory does is become a series of philosophical what-ifs. Which is not Marxism.

Reading Lenin will help you understand the philosophy behind why we ought to commit ourselves to radical action, it is not an explainer on exactly how that radical action is to be organized. Indeed, Lenin himself believed this pamphlet to only be an introductory summary that he never got to finish. "What is to be Done" is primarily about how they ought to be get to start thinking about how to organize themselves (the politically radical Russian Social Democrats who have been continually denied chances to reform the system) with the working class. So there are some parallels to today.

I agree, learning about organizational methods is a great use of your time. How to run a meeting, deal with interpersonal conflict, look out for feds, manage a budget, manage an inventory, etc. All these things will only be a benefit for you. Btw, ALL OF THIS IS THEORY. Management theory, but theory nevertheless. You cannot escape theory.

This country is literally run by a bunch of fascist dorks. Being a dork has nothing to do with it.

Historical leftist theory and the history of leftist events are absolutely relevant today, and it is a completely anti-intellectual reactionary position to think otherwise. I'm not saying that everyone has to read theory, but it would be nice if some people did! We wouldn't have to re-invent the wheel every three to four years if people who were committed to political action spent time reading more on their theory and history.

If you keep committing yourself to these 1980's juvenile highschool stereotypes I am going to have an aneurysm. "Bookworms don't lead anything." Get over yourself. I'm not saying start a book club.

And, no shit, person who pulled a double at Wendy's is going to be far more interested in a drink and a conversation than reading anything. Which is fine! That is how the majority of socialist organizations throughout the years have organized, through bars, gyms, and social clubs.