everything you said, 10,000% agree. god forbid the Python purists hear it though, they'll tell you that you're just too stupid to understand the language enough to use it and will compare it with literally every language just to prove that they have the "biggest" python.

[–] tyler@programming.dev 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

The main problem is that Python purists have hardly used any other languages so they don’t realize how shitty their tooling is. The most direct comparison is Ruby and the tooling difference is astronomical. I always refer to this article for how bad the situation is https://chriswarrick.com/blog/2023/01/15/how-to-improve-python-packaging/

[–] GreenKnight23@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

the only thing pythonists love more than intellectually dunking on devs is hating Ruby. it's like a universal character flaw they all mistook as a benefit.

[–] tyler@programming.dev 1 points 1 day ago

Yeah it’s pretty crazy, like Ruby was extremely well known for how good its tooling is, so much so that it inspired numerous other language package managers and build tools like elixir’s mix, rust’s cargo, and the lock files in npm and composer.

The testing frameworks everyone uses today are directly descended from Ruby’s RSpec, almost to the letter. BDD and TDD were pioneered by Ruby devs.

Extension functions in Kotlin are a direct result of lessons learned from Ruby metaprogramming while Rust and Elixir’s syntax are both directly inspired by Ruby.

The beauty of Ruby’s DSLs also spread to almost every new language. Kotlin and Gradle DSL scripts are possible because of Ruby.

Rails inspired an entirely new paradigm of web frameworks, where things were supposed to be easy by default. Laravel, Spring Boot, Phoenix, Django all are directly inspired by this, even though Django came out first it wasn’t easy to use.

——

Python gave us… Jupyter notebooks, whitespace which no one uses, and not much else.