this post was submitted on 14 Apr 2026
62 points (100.0% liked)

europe

2014 readers
107 users here now

Community for a certain asian peninsula.

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
 

cross-posted from: https://lemmygrad.ml/post/11317382

France is on the eve of voting one of the most shameful laws in its history: it would effectively outlaw criticism of Israel and criminalize any speech seen as even remotely sympathetic to whoever the French government chooses to designate a "terrorist group."

In effect this law would turn France's foreign policy into unchallengeable dogma backed by prison time. You could literally be sent for 5 years in prison if you, for instance, call what France says are "terrorists" a "resistance group."

Think for instance Nelson Mandela during the apartheid (the ANC was on every Western terrorist list) or, heck, France's own Résistance against Nazi Germany - designated as "terrorists" by the Vichy regime and the Nazi occupation.

It's frankly absolutely insane.

The new law is called "loi Yadan" after its author Caroline Yadan, a MP who represents French expatriates living in Israel. The U.S. has congressmen paid by AIPAC: France has cut out the middleman entirely, we have MPs whose constituency is literally in Israel.

The law has already passed committee and heads to a full parliamentary vote on April 16th - 3 days from now - under a very unusual fast-track procedure. Seven of eleven parliamentary groups have said they'll vote yes and the law is expected to pass.

What does the law say? Let me quote from it directly (full text here: https://www.assemblee-nationale.fr/dyn/17/textes/l17b2358_texte-adopte-commission):

  1. Article 1 introduces the concept of "implicit" provocation to terrorism and punishes it with five years imprisonment and a fine of €75,000

That's the one I was speaking about. Under this provision, describing anyone France designates as terrorist as a "resistance movement" - the way France describes its own Résistance against Nazi occupation - could effectively become a crime.

The key concept is what does "implicit provocation to terrorism" mean? Nobody knows. And that's the point. It means whatever a prosecutor wants it to mean: a perfectly good case could be made that, for instance, quoting international law on the right of occupied peoples to resist with respect to Hamas is, in fact, "implicit provocation to terrorism."

France's most famous anti-terrorism judge, Marc Trévidic, says he has never seen anything like it in his entire career (https://xcancel.com/CharliesIngalls/status/2043333726541619459?s=20): "Implicit provocation to terrorism: do you realize what that means? Becoming a censor of other people's thoughts, trying to guess what a person really meant."

  1. The same article also expands the terrorism apology offense to include "minimizing or trivializing acts of terrorism in an outrageous manner."

This is even crazier: until now, "apology of terrorism" meant actually expressing a favorable judgment of "terrorist acts" (which is already insane because, as we all know, one person's terrorist is another's freedom fighter).

Well, under this new provision, a judge could decide that providing context, explaining root causes, or insufficiently condemning an act amounts to "trivializing" terrorism - and that would now be punishable with 5 years in prison.

So, for instance, a history teacher explaining the origins of Hamas or Hezbollah is providing context - but a prosecutor could argue that contextualization is trivialization. The same reasoning could apply to a journalist, a researcher, or anyone on social media who says "yes, it was terrible, but here's why it happened." The "but" becomes a crime, as it is trivialization.

  1. Article 4 expands Holocaust denial law

Under current French law, denying the Holocaust is already a crime. This provision extends that crime by specifying that contestation of crimes against humanity now includes, "whatever its formulation, a negation, minimization, or outrageous trivialization" of those crimes.

Again with "outrageous trivialization"! In this instance the very authors of the text - Caroline Yadan and her colleagues - explain their reasoning explicitly in the law's preamble (https://www.assemblee-nationale.fr/dyn/17/textes/l17b0575_proposition-loi): "Comparing the State of Israel to the Nazi regime would thereby be punishable as an outrageous trivialization of the Shoah."

So while the provision is written in general terms, its architects are openly saying what it's for: making it a crime to draw any parallel between Israel's actions and those of the Nazis.

  1. Article 2 creates a brand new crime: calling for the destruction of a state.

The law adds to an existing 1881 press law a provision punishing anyone who "publicly, in disregard of the right of peoples to self-determination and the purposes and principles of the UN Charter, calls for the destruction of a state recognized by the French Republic." Five years imprisonment, €75,000 fine.

The qualifiers about self-determination and the UN Charter are meant to sound reassuring. But what does "destruction" mean? In practice, if you advocate for a one-state solution where Israelis and Palestinians live as equals, you are de-facto calling for the "destruction" of the state of Israel. Well, that would now be punishable by 5 years in prison 🤷

There you go. Absolutely insane: if this new law passes, and it unfortunately very much looks like it will, France - the country that gave the world the Declaration of the Rights of Man, the country whose national identity is built on the Résistance - will have made it illegal to use the word 'resistance' about anyone the government doesn't like. Jean Moulin would be prosecuted. De Gaulle would be prosecuted.

The only people who wouldn't be prosecuted are those who stay silent. Which, of course, is the whole point.

text of the law in French => https://www.assemblee-nationale.fr/dyn/17/textes/l17b2358_texte-adopte-commission

source => https://xcancel.com/RnaudBertrand/status/2043516049153491323#m

all 21 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] buckykat@hexbear.net 30 points 4 weeks ago

So, for instance, a history teacher explaining the origins of Hamas or Hezbollah is providing context - but a prosecutor could argue that contextualization is trivialization.

yeonmi-park in France, it is illegal to not fall out of a coconut tree.

[–] SacredExcrement@hexbear.net 29 points 4 weeks ago (2 children)

Caroline Yadan, a MP who represents French expatriates living in Israel.

lmao

Well, under this new provision, a judge could decide that providing context, explaining root causes, or insufficiently condemning an act amounts to "trivializing" terrorism - and that would now be punishable with 5 years in prison.

So this is literally making it criminal to not only support groups the French government has declared as terrorist organizations, but also the teaching or explaining of what they are or have done in a broader sense or attempt to contextualize their actions. I can't imagine why the Israeli MP (sorry, the Fr*nch Israeli representative) wanted to introduce this bill.

[–] chgxvjh@hexbear.net 12 points 4 weeks ago

Politicians depoliticizing politics

[–] Pentacat@hexbear.net 1 points 4 weeks ago

How are they ever going to get counterterrorism “experts?”

[–] chgxvjh@hexbear.net 19 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

They basically invented modern terrorism and it's part of their national mythology.

[–] Awoo@hexbear.net 19 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)

Last ditch effort to purge the left before LFI win the next election?

A law like this would enable them to imprison pretty much everyone in LFI.

[–] DragonBallZinn@hexbear.net 17 points 4 weeks ago

Fascism: an idea so good it’s illegal not to be one.

[–] Evilsandwichman@hexbear.net 18 points 4 weeks ago

According to chuds:

Telling them to shut up when they engage in misogyny because live action cowboy bebop's Faye actress doesn't have a waist size smaller than her head is punishing them for wrongthink

People literally going to jail for five years and paying devastating fines because they have opinions opposed to the government however is......not an issue, or even okay

Oh I'm so surprised

[–] darkcalling@hexbear.net 12 points 4 weeks ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago) (3 children)

Incredible. Incidentally this instance is hosted in France yes? So we'd all be doing incredible amounts of terrorism which yes haha, it's absurd and all but uh not a good idea to be at risk as they could get an order to install police-spyware on our servers for violations of this law, start arresting French users and hand the rest of the info over to US intelligence.

I mean the youtube block messages on post embeds are always in French so it's kind of a big clue.

[–] acidic7_7@hexbear.net 10 points 4 weeks ago* (last edited 4 weeks ago) (1 children)

We need to get this instance the hell out of there immediately

I know nothing about hosting so probably easier said than done but still we can't operate like this

[–] darkcalling@hexbear.net 4 points 4 weeks ago

Well the problem I suppose is where to host. Wouldn't be wise to do so in the US or its vassal Canada.

Most of western Europe is a lot more subservient to American wants and court orders than France which has some modicum of notions of independence (and its own nuclear weapons to back it up).

Trying to host outside the western world in Russia and such runs into payment issues due to sanctions though with effort using crypto it should be possible to get around them. There's always Hong Kong which is more open to the west but under Chinese control more or less.

[–] blunder@hexbear.net 2 points 4 weeks ago (1 children)
[–] CARCOSA@hexbear.net 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Thank you, discussing with the other admins to look at moving hosts

[–] Mardoniush@hexbear.net 11 points 4 weeks ago
[–] DragonBallZinn@hexbear.net 11 points 4 weeks ago

“WORDS CANNOT EXPRESS HOW MUCH I HATE FRANCE RIGHT NOW!” - TF2 soldier