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This is FUD (and I am getting really tired of this half-assed blog post being shared everywhere). The older OMEMO version used is not insecure. The newer version is better, yes, but it is an enhancement in regards to metadata protection, the core e2ee of the message body is unchanged and secure in both versions.

I can't really find anywhere that clarifies what version of OMEMO that Movim is currently using, but if I had to guess it would be 0.3.0.

However, I want to point out that the creator of that linked blog actually removed a response in the comments from an OMEMO developer which clarified some things (you can it read here), which personally I think was rather odd/bad faith of them to do.

According to that response, there's nothing really wrong with OMEMO 0.3.0, as the OMEMO developer considers it a stable standard that clients can safely implement, and the newer versions basically being public beta releases toward a stable 'OMEMO 2' standard that can eventually replace 0.3.0.

I also think the blog author's argument should be put into perspective; from most security expert's POV (including the blog author linked), any app that allows encryption to be disabled is considered flawed or insecure compared to the gold standard of always on E2EE. This would rule out Matrix, XMPP, and certainly any other Discord replacement like Fluxer or Stoat (which offer no encryption). Ultimately only Signal, Deltachat or similar app would be the only options a security expert could recommend, as those experts are prioritizing security above all, regardless of use-case, needs, or practical threat level.

Signal is centralized and requires a phone number (deal-breaker for me), where as Deltachat is decentralized and does not. Deltachat is a fantastic messenger, but it is only a good replacement for Signal, not Discord. Nor are any of the other 'encrypted by default with no option to disable' messengers.

If we contrast Movim with optional OMEMO against Discord (which is not only entirely unencrypted, but also actively working with authorities and spying on you); Movim is a monumental improvement while still (eventually) providing Discord-like features. No other possible Discord replacement comes close besides Matrix (which has its own problems, more than XMPP I would say).

I would suggest that for the average user, XMPP with OMEMO 0.3.0 is pretty darn good. It'll certainly provide very good privacy for encrypted DMs to your friends or groups where it's enabled, and no nosy server owner or relay server will be able to read or decrypt them.

For people where security is absolutely paramount, and they believe they may be specifically targeted by a state actor, then they should definitely stick with a E2EE always-enabled platform like Deltachat. But for the average user, who likely isn't even using a VPN, or Tor, or may even still be using Windows or a non-grapheneOS phone? XMPP with OMEMO 0.3.0 is going to more than suffice.

And as time goes on, that new 'OMEMO 2' will become stable, and the clients can then migrate to that. But it's already the best privacy respecting Discord alternative we've got (IMO), and it'll likely only get better :)

But mo :)

While there are forks of conversations (Cheagram & Monocles), Movim is not a fork, AFAIK. Did you read it was somewhere?

Only if you need to screenshare with audio! And only because that feature was just implemented (Firefox uses a different mechanism to screenshare with audio, and likely requires its own implementation). Movim works fine otherwise in Firefox or Librewolf.

And remember, Discord itself is just an Electron app, which is literally just a stripped down Chromium browser without the browser controls, but is also itself spyware. Running Movim in a de-googled chromium is a huge step up, and running it in Firefox even more so. I think it's important not to make perfect be the enemy of good, in this case :)

Ah, good to know! :p

Due to the architecture of Movim with parts of it running on the server a "proper" app wouldn't make much sense. On the plus side this also means it is very lightweight in the browser, unlike JS heavy browser apps or Electron wrappers.

But since Movim is fully XMPP standard compliant, you can use a native XMPP Android app like Monocles Chat with the same account and have most features included in it as well.

It's technically possible that native Movim apps could be built in the future, but it'd probably be a bit too much for the dev to tackle without additional help.

The other clients can interact with each other without any special actions, similar to how Lemmy and Piefed users can. And you can use 1 XMPP account and log into any client, and it will retain your contacts and message history across them all. However:

• A Conversations user wouldn't be able to join any group audio/video calls with Movim/Dino users, since it can only do 1-on-1 calls at the moment. It could still call individual Movim/Dino users with video.
• Dino is fully compatible with Movim's group audio/video calls, but AFAIK it cannot initiate screensharing yet.

If a Conversations user wanted to message a user currently using Movim, they would just need to add their username as a contact (Something@YourXMPPhost[.]com, just like Lemmy works), and the Movim user would get a notification just like they would if it'd come from a Movim user, and they can begin chatting or initiate a 1-on-1 call.

PWA > App.

I tried movim a few months ago, had to drop it due to the lack of apps

You would be surprised how performant php7 and later has gotten 🤷