this post was submitted on 08 Dec 2025
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I agree with your general logic, but this was specific example. The "meanwhileongrad" is specifically aimed at documenting and ridiculing far left extremism (support for russian genocidal imperialism, knowingly lying that Cuba/NK is a democracy, claiming any opposition to the current regime in Venezuela is a CIA operation).
Shared this earlier:
https://gui.fediseer.com/instances/detail/lemmy.ml
There is no reason for DB0 to give this endorsement. They could have simply said nothing (ML has multiple other endorsements, albeit ones with easily provable lies).
Thank you. I wonder how long ago that endorsement was made though? Lemmy.ml was one of the oldest instances - I think Hexbear technically predates them but in the sense of using a different software than Lemmy, and similarly for dbzer0 (who iirc used a forum software that was not federated). If the sole options are Reddit vs. Lemmy, then you take what you can get.
Study the history a bit: those truly were different times. Like for one thing, Lemmy.world did not exist, so virtually all communities were on Lemmy.ml. Since then Lemmy.ml has been relegated to almost obscurity, but back then was a very different story... Comics, Memes, News, everything was on lemmy.ml, before it was as widely known about their moderation practices - in large part bc the admins kept that as an echo chamber, silencing any dissent with full instance-wide perma-bans, so it is entirely plausible that many people simply did not know what it was all about.
Also, there was the whole distraction issue where it was "claimed" that the most extremist leftist stuff was relegated over to lemmygrad.ml, which while true, should not be taken at face value when considering just how much extremism remains. But, at the time... I could see someone believing that misinformation, for being plausible in that context.
Fwiw I agree with you that they would have done better to have simply said nothing, but also I agree with dbzer0 in that narrowly within just the reasons they stipulated, Lemmy.ml in its earlier days truly was like that. No I wasn't here for that, I just found it interesting to poke around to read older posts about the history of things:-).
These are all true statements (and to this day there are communities of expert systems especially that refuse to migrate away from Lemmy.ml - oh well, their loss as the rest of us refuse to be held hostage by their poor choices):
You might ask dbzer0 if they still endorse Lemmy.ml tankies in today's environment, or are there any more recent statements that they've already put out? Anyway, I agree that this is not a high moment for them - I'm just not sure it's all that terribly low either, as it would be if they did such today.
Edit: also it's crucial to note there that an "endorsement" does not mean "you should totally go create an account over there", but rather "I would like my instance to federate with this instance, as its users serve up worthwhile content that I would like to participate with" - so not quite the same meaning as the word "endorse" would typically imply.
You asked for substantive receipts around my original statement, I provided:
You yourself provide the following:
These points speak for themselves and they are merely the tip of the iceberg. There are tons of post by Devel, a senior mod on ML, claiming that China's genocide of the Uighurs never happened, that access to food in the 80s USSR was comparable to that of the US and bunch of other things.
DB0 has no issues with such claims and they will protect users such as Devel and many other genocidal tankies. Either DB0 are comfortable Devel's claims or they are not, there is no half pregnant option.
I see. I once petitioned Discuss.Online to defederate from both hexbear.net (trolls) and Lemmy.ml (tankies) - and it had already done so from Lemmygrad.ml. Unfortunately, nearly every single instance across the entire Threadiverse federates with lemmy.ml. I think that it should be opt-in for new users, but since those admins are also the main devs for the Lemmy codebase, obviously that will never happen.
Lemmy itself is a Nazi (actually tankie) bar. PieFed is far less so, but still it federates with lemmy.ml so technically we are as well. By virtue of being here you and I are tainted by association with it. But, in this community, both of us on different PieFed instances, not so much?
Db0 more so than most then, since they offered that endorsement and did not subsequently retract it. Also, some instances have switched from Lemmy to PieFed, while they have not. So, they do seem more okay with federating with tankies than most other instances, on the spectrum, I will grant you that.
I understand what you meant about the half pregnant option, and on that I disagree. Someone could have 50% likelihood of being pregnant, or be 50% along the projected timeline (or looking back after birth, someone could more definitively call the 50% progress marker), or weirder effects like a fetus could be stillborn so necrotic tissue exists like a pregnancy, but also is not alive like a pregnancy, so matches in some respects while differing in others. Life is rarely so easily categorized into binary options.
Db0 is not perfect, nor am I or you, but they are a far cry from what lemmy.ml is, which itself is also a far cry from what Lemmygrad.ml and hexbear.net are.
No one is saying anything about being perfect or not.
We are discussing whether DB0 endorses tankies and enables tankies. You asked for something concrete and specific to prove this; I obliged.
With all due respect, the other points are not relevant as far as I am concerned.
DB0 endorses, enables and covers for tankies. This is a fact.
Someone downvoted you - I just wanted to say that it was not me.