Ask Lemmy

you're starting too far down the line

most vehicles nowadays are gimmicks

the real question is why can't we get a simple economical vehicle and not unrepairable subcription-based spyware on wheels with dangerous features, regardless of engine type

My FIL has a 2021 Smart ForFour EV that's as barebones as it gets. No screen, buttons and knobs for the climate control, popout rear windows AND an actual key you have to put into an actual hole.

It also looks like manufacturers are catching on and making EVs for normal people. Renault. Kia and Hyundai all have nice selections plus some of the Chinese models from Leap and BYD.

So it's definitely getting better on the EV front.

These definitely exist. They are typically referred to as 'compliance cars' - i.e. the manufacturer is obligated, usually by regulations, to produce an EV, but they don't want to spend money designing a new platform for it - so they take an existing model, rip out the engine, cram a motor and batteries wherever they will fit and call it good. Examples: Volkswagen eGolf, Fiat 500e, Mercedes B Class EV. Ford Focus Electric...

However, doing this means you are constrained to the shape of the combustion vehicle it is based on. So the aerodynamics may not be optimal to get the best range, you may have a transmission tunnel taking up space in the interior that is no longer necessary, directly swapping the position of the engine and the motor/inverter means you lose the opportunity to repurpose the front of the car for additional storage - ultimately it ends up compromised in one way or another.

If on the other hand you design the platform from the ground up to handle an electric drivetrain then all of these points can be taken into account.

(And regarding cars in general becoming rolling computers: this is not an EV specific issue, unfortunately.)

Dacia Spring ?

Dacia is usually pretty much bare bones

In the home electronics store I nearly asked if they had any TVs that weren’t smart, nearly.

So three issues.

An ICE drivetrain is a certain size and shape- you have a big lump of engine under the hood, a fat cigar of a transmission under the center of the car, a gas tank in the back, etc.
An EV drivetrain has a VERY DIFFERENT size and shape- the entire battery and drive system is essentially a skateboard on top of which you can build the rest of the car.

So you can't just take an ICE car and swap out the ICE for batteries and motor. The whole car needs a redesign. And if you're making the car for modern, tech-savvy buyers, why would you make a boring old low-tech car?

Second- EVERY car is turning into a rolling datacenter like a smartphone. Try to buy a base model car with no screen and manual windows or whatever- it doesn't exist anymore in many brands. Automakers go for the high profit items, and that's NOT the base models.

Third- a lot of the tech is now mandatory. Backup cameras, and soon driver attention monitoring among other things.

Sad thing is- I think there's a demand for it, if the price is right. If getting rid of most of the tech dropped $10-20k off the sticker price I think whoever tried it would sell millions. I'm not sure you're allowed to anymore though.

Driving a kia e-niro. There's nothing gimmicky about it except for the melody that plays when you start the car. Everything else is pretty much down to earth regular car stuff. And with a price below 40k, in 2021, I think it wasn't even that expensive for a EV.

In ICE cars the base models/brands are no nonsense and you get more of gimmicks as you move up the pricelist. EVs start much higher on the pricelist so they have to include some gimmicks by default to not feel a total ripoff.

In Europe Volkswagen has 3 brands that sell cars built on same platform but they are positioned in three market segments. This made sense for ICE because pricing and features progression worked while parts were shared. Now their EV lineup cost basically the same across all brands because the baseline is so high.

There are those cars, of course. But they are less common in your country.

Cars getting more expensive is in all car companies' interests.

The first company that is able to commodify modular drop-in BEV replacements for ICE vehicles would make a fortune:

Battery packs shaped to slot into engine bays, transmission tunnels and fuel tank cavities.

Individual motors directly into your preferred wheel wells (FWD? RWD? AWD? 4WD? whatever you like).

Drop-in ECU to interface with the existing chassis.

The sort of thing that someone mechanically minded could knock out in their own garage over a weekend or two, or you could get done at a professional shop in a day.

Imagine taking your favourite silhouette, and giving it exactly the range and performance you desire - at the fraction of the cost of a new EV.

They do. Or least they sometimes do. I drive a Kia Soul EV. It’s… a Kia Soul with an electric motor and battery instead of all the internal combustion stuff.

Show me a single non-EV car for sale that doesn't raise all the same objections