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Do you all remember when they forced all one stars and above to attend a political rally at the Pentagon? And Trump and Hegseth would pause for the applause lines. And the generals just sat there at attention betraying no facial expressions whatsoever.
Yeah. This military is not personally loyal to Trump.
Edit: but do keep in mind that coups are usually led by middle-ranking officers, not general officers.
I'm a "general" in my field. It is far more often that it is a thankless burden than it is a benefit.
People at the top of their field, in my experience, have insulated themselves from volatility, that's it. And this security cannot be conferred. I am powerless to dictate the market. I have just a sliver of influence over the culture. I can work pretty much anywhere, but nowhere is objectively better than anywhere else. I'm just as free as I am trapped.
In short, the generals are perhaps difficult to remove from the boat, but the oligarchy always sets the course.
Several of those generals are now fired my dude
Aren’t most of those guys gone now though?
The black ones are.
Because that’s what ICE is for, obviously.
Yep, along with their new shock gloves
I hope someone posts the "do not" before they are used so we have time to prepare.
Time to show up in conductive clothing and short those things out.
Has the military had a plan for anything over the past year? It feels like they're just reacting to the whims of a crazy man.
Not having a plan isn't comforting at all. It, also, means they have no plans to pushback against it.
Oh they definitely have plans, but that's exactly what they have been forced to do.
The civilians in charge of the government refuse to listen to the experts though. Any expert, not just the military. So they can't use any of the plans, they instead have to handle everything on the fly. Like running an improv show with non-comedians.
I mean, I get the point but this response is because a Democratic senator specifically asked for comment on this, not just saying it randomly.
Will they step in if ICE shows up?
To help ICE, sure.
Doubt. ICE recruited a bunch of untrained, undisciplined, stolen valor wannabe-soldiers, with PT so shit half can’t even fit into their gear, who act real tough when they’re roughing up unarmed women and children, waive guns in the faces of non-combatants, and murder American civilians on the evening news. All that bullshit is peak disrespect in military honor culture. Aside from the occasional racist shithead, there can’t be much support for ICE in the military, and certainly no respect.
This message brought to you by Abu Gharib and My Lai.
I'm not worried about NG or army at the polls. Those guys have better training than most cops, from institutions with stricter rules around civilian engagement. And the people recruited are a mixed bag politically - many of them just want to go to college or get trained in a trade. They won't want to be there, or to bust heads, or to fuck over the Constitution.
But that's not who they'll send. They'll send ICE, who have over a year's worth of experience terrorizing and abusing civilians, preferentially the most vulnerable ones least likely to fight back.
Their training is to kill. It’s in the conduct and prosecution of war.
They might be better trained, but that training is not applicable to any law enforcement activity.
And it’s absolutely not fucking applicable to exercise your rights as an American citizen to vote.
Not all of them. I worked cyber systems in the Air Force and Air National Guard. I served State Active Duty during the 2018 election cycle (we didn't go to any polling places and were told to wear civilian clothes in case we had to so we didn't disturb people). During our basic training we spent all of half a day at a range learning to shoot. Not exactly a ton of learning how to kill. Most people in the military aren't taught how to kill. There are far more people doing logistics work than doing the deadly stuff.
During our basic training we spent all of half a day at a range learning to shoot. Not exactly a ton of learning how to kill. Most people in the military aren't taught how to kill. There are far more people doing logistics work than doing the deadly stuff.
They just taught you to wing ‘em?
More to the point. Everyone in the military is taught to kill. Not everyone is taught to be the trigger puller.
At no point in history has the trigger puller, the spear-stabby-stab-guy, or the rocky-smash-smash-man ever gone to war without others fighting along side them- or indeed, people providing logistical support.
All of that is what allows a military to function.
The purpose of the armed services is to kill the enemies of the state. Ostensibly for the protection of the state’s citizens.
That is why you being deployed to a polling place would “disturb” people.
Yes, but also no. Like I said my training wasn't in killing it was in cyber systems. Securing a server does not kill people. Yes, it's all part of the weapon system, but I have no clue how to wield those weapons along with most people in the military.
I think it witless be more disturbing because people would assume something is being rigged. They would assume the government is exerting some sort of influence over the election. Especially if we were there getting on a computer... We don't even carry weapons.
Their training is to kill.
I was in the Air Force, and our training included more about hand-to-hand non-lethal crowd control than actual killing.
See my response to the other guy that said similar-
Everyone in the armed services are trained to kill. Not everyone is a trigger puller.
Even if all you’re doing is serving as a cook- that role is to support and enable others; and is part of the overall job of killing enemies of the state.
Okay, then every taxpayer is a killer, too.
Paying taxes is compulsory. Military service is not.
When the military isn deployed, the purpose is to kill enemies of the state.
When the military is deployed to polling stations - those enemies are voting citizens.
Ask yourself why it’s military cyber sec and not, I dunno, FBI or, like, state-level people.
Well, duh. That's what ICE is for.
It will most likely be stupid ICE agents.
volunteers. armed volunteers.. and probably more than a few paid, too.
coordinated by the republican national committee. just like it was in the before times.
Who needs a military when you have a paramilitary called ICE?
Good luck with that. Unless you coup him he's sending you.
You are very much allowed to disregard illegal orders. In fact, you have to by law.
But we haven't seen much of that over the past... ever.
Because there's no actual infrastructure for it.
And patently illegal orders tend to not get passed along. It might be handled administratively or dealt with in military courts, but just because someone can’t recall an example of an illegal order being ignored and the insubordination later vindicated only means that person hasn’t read very much.
Even cases of POTUS’ orders being ignored due to illegality are not that uncommon.
If your government is giving you illegal orders, you probably aren’t going to get too far with “I was just following the law when I disobeyed the illegal orders you gave me.”
Of course not. It's gonna be spur of them moment and likely depends on how fucked the polls show the GOP are.
No plans, just actions.
Just because they're not that overt in their election interference doesn't mean that they aren't trying to suppress votes with ICE deployments and USPS ballot non-delivery and delivery delays, in addition to the extensive gerrymandering conducted mostly by Republican-led states to sway the results in the House.
So they'll do it without any plans, like all the other stuff the military's been doing.
That's a complete non committal answer. No plans doesn't mean plans won't occur suddenly and without warning. "...any unlawful order..." is also highly specifc wording.
Probably important note: The Joint Chiefs of Staff are strictly advisory; they don't command troops and don't have any authority over troops. That said, in any case such an intervention would be done by either ICE or red state National Guard units; the people controlling Trump would be utterly stupid to send the military.
Yet
sigh…
Yet