this post was submitted on 26 Jul 2026
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Ragebait answers only

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[–] surewhynotlem@lemmy.world 3 points 24 minutes ago

This was answered decades ago

[–] megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago) (1 children)

The question is: Is it the velocity of the object relative to the portal that matters or the velocity of the object in some other frame of reference?

In the later case, we must ask how the portals at different angles don’t send objects flying off at the speed of the milkyway’s travel through the universe.

The answer that requires the least assumptions and justifications is B.

[–] tomi000@lemmy.world 3 points 28 minutes ago (1 children)

Exactly. What would that 'other frame of reference' be and how would the portal know about it?

[–] Prunebutt@slrpnk.net 1 points 17 minutes ago

What would that 'other frame of reference' be

How bout the other portal?

[–] Simulation6@sopuli.xyz 14 points 2 hours ago

If the downward moving portal hits the platform and there is some elastic rebound, then the object will bounce outward slightly.

Rage bait answer: Portals can't exist, it is from a child's game.

[–] Kolanaki@pawb.social 13 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago) (5 children)

The object's momentum is preserved. Movement of the entrance portal does nothing. Think of it like stepping though a door, except you're Buster Keaton and the door hole is falling on you.

[–] tomi000@lemmy.world 2 points 17 minutes ago

Whats the difference between an object moving and everything else moving? For an observer on the sun every one of us has huge momentum which would be preserved when entering a portal. Momentum is always relative to some frame of reference. Momentum 'toward' the portal would be conserved and mirrored through the other portal.

[–] ThatWeirdGuy1001@lemmy.world 11 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago) (1 children)

I brought this up on another comment that's for some reason now deleted but, if the universe moves around you, would you not perceive it as movement?

[–] Derpenheim@lemmy.zip 2 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

There is no such thing as an absolute inertial frame of reference. If you are in free fall on earth, you would experience the same sensation as being in space. The only things that would tell you otherwise are the air resistance hitting you and what you can see.

So no, you would not be able to tell the universe is moving around you unless something else in the universe hit you.

[–] tomi000@lemmy.world 1 points 13 minutes ago

The first part made sense, then you contradicted yourself at the end^^ If the universe moves around you, you could literally see things moving. It would be the same as you moving relative to everything else

[–] berber@feddit.org 4 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

well, in my opinion it is a bit of a paradox. i think you are partially correct.

your door analogy may be right from the perspective of the platform on which the cube is. however, one flaw is that the whole space is moving, not just the door. as soon as the cube enters that door, it will be inside that space, and if you consider the cube part of it, moving that space "downward", then due the cube being held by the platform, you could consider the cube moving "upward" in the space behind the orange portal. if you consider preserving momentum there, then as soon as the apparatus stops moving, the cube should not stop its momentum and move further up in the space.

or look at it like this: if you are behind the orange portal, meaning you are looking at the blue portal, you will see a cube moving towards you. then as soon as the platform hits the wall of the orange portal, the preserved momentum should make the cube "fly".

the change of perspective leads to two different conclusions, therefore i think it is a paradox.

the problem sort of is that there are two "spacetimes" that are kind of being changed. one could interpret it as both of these effects "pulling" against each other since when the cube has partially passed the portal, one part of the cube is "in one of the spacetimes", ant the other part in the other. ultimately though, the cube then would actually fly because in the limit (infinitesinally close to when the platform hits the portal wall) the cube is completely on the other side of the portal, so from the view of that spacetime, the cube does get pushed and should fly.

i don't even remember if it is possible in the video game for walls with portals that move. a video game would probablt have some kind of "center of mass", like a single vector of coordinates where describing the position of the object. there is no notion of "partially" being somewhere (except for collision boxes, but i don't mean that). so also from that view the box would fly. however, in most video games (with or without portals), if a platform moves up and suddenly stops, the object won't travel further in that direction anyway, especially not ulwards (even sideways usually not).

[–] Elgenzay@lemmy.ml 3 points 3 hours ago

As for the portals moving in the game, portals are destroyed if the panel they're on is moved except for one specific part, where you can put a portal on a panel moving laterally to get a laser to cut the tubes connecting to the neurotoxin tank. That part needed to be explicitly programmed to allow it, and it's not possible without cheating to physically reach that portal.

[–] MrNesser@lemmy.world 1 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

More like a hole in the wall with you standing perfectly still while the wall moves past you.

Except the wall has no mass or width.

[–] observes_depths@aussie.zone 1 points 3 hours ago

Correct. If a stationary door/portal has no affect on the cube's velocity than that's also true for a moving door/portal.

[–] observes_depths@aussie.zone 7 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

Both portals stationary: object velocity unchanged.

Both portals moving at the same speed: object velocity unchanged.

Entry portal moving: object pushed out at the same speed it entered.

Exit portal moving faster than object entered: object explodes.

[–] Peffse@lemmy.world 170 points 7 hours ago (5 children)
[–] ThatWeirdGuy1001@lemmy.world 36 points 5 hours ago

Stop stealing all my upvotes

Perfectly understood the assignment, 10/10, no notes.

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[–] markz@suppo.fi 4 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

Portals don't exist so the piston crushes the cube

[–] NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

The answer is definitely B (see other comments), but I think the more interesting question is, how does it affect the portals themselves and the surfaces they're attached to?

When the portals are attached to a solid unmovable wall (as in the games), we can pretty much ignore the forces acting upon the wall as they will just be automatically cancelled out by the normal force. But the same does not apply for portals attached to detached panels. Let's say that instead of a piston pushing down, the portal is attached a free-falling panel with the portal facing down.

We are inclined to assume that as the portal falls onto the cube, it feels no force, as if it fell through air or through a vacuum. But is that really the case? Maybe instead, the falling portal experiences resistance from the cube? Or even, actually, an accelerating force?

Let's assume conservation of momentum at each end of the portal. That is, in the general case: if the portal (which we assume has no mass) is attached to an object with mass M and velocity V, and "swallows" a cube or other object with mass m and velocity v, and at the end of this interaction the portal-surface object with mass M has velocity V', then we expect:

M × V' = (M × V) + (m × v)

Mass is not conserved because the cube was transferred to the other portal.

Solve for V':

V' = V + (m/M) v

This is a strange result. The cube's momentum is imparted into the portal, but the result would be different depending on our reference frame. From a reference frame tracking the cube pre-interaction, v = 0 (by definition) and so V' = V, the portal-surface object has no change in velocity. But in any other reference frame, it does.

Physics can't be affected by reference frame (thanks, relativity) so this analysis must be wrong.

... I'll keep thinking on this.

[–] NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 2 hours ago

Okay, after thinking about this a while, I've decided that conservation of momentum just doesn't work, unless the portal actually absorbs the mass of every object passing through it, which would probably cause its own set of contradictions.

Instead, I think forces that act through the portal are applied to the portal. What do I mean by this? Well, take this classic case of a cube floating halfway through two floor portals:

      ____            ____
     |    |          |    |
___++++++++++______----------___

(sorry, can't do better than ASCII art right now)

The system has reached equilibrium, and nothing is moving. Both halves of the cube are being pulled down by gravity, but cancel each other out by applying a normal force on each other right at the portal interface. What I'm claiming is that this normal force is applied to the portals, which ultimately transfer it to the floor. If this entire floor was a scale, it would measure the calibrated weight of the Weighted Storage Cube.

But this is the static analysis. What happens when objects are in motion? To be continued...

[–] portifornia@piefed.social 10 points 5 hours ago (2 children)

My take:

The cube's mass is x (eg one gram) and its velocity is zero, therefore its momentum (m*v) is zero. Objects in motion tend to stay in motion, while objects at rest (e.g. momentum of zero), tend to stay at rest.

The thing which is moving, is the portal. At best, the event horizon of it reaches the leading-end then the trailing-end of the cube at the speed the portal is moving over the depth of the cube. If the portal moves faster, that distance is covered faster, and the full cube is entirely on the other end of the other portal faster [than a slower moving portal].

Since going through the portal is a frictionless and forceless action, the speed at which the portal fully envelops the cube would neither add nor remove momentum upon it. And if the cube did have its own momentum it would be maintained, but since it does not, the cube would not move until another force, like gravity, acted upon it.

So, A.

[–] meekah@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 3 hours ago

I don't think this can work. Think through it in several steps rather than just one. Once the cube just started entering the portal, a part of it will already be on the other side, as close to the 2nd portal as possible. When the portal continues moving, more of the cube needs to be on the other side, so it "pushes" the first part of the cube further away. The cube imparts momentum onto itself.

Another way to look at it is using reference frames. It really doesn't make a difference whether the cube is moving towards the portal or the portal towards the cube. It only matters what the difference of velocity is. The difference of velocity must be maintained on the other side of the portal, and since the 2nd portal is stationary, the cube must move.

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[–] TotallynotJessica@lemmy.world 68 points 7 hours ago (8 children)

You can't place a portal on a moving surface in either game, so neither.

[–] lime@feddit.nu 33 points 6 hours ago (2 children)

you can in one specific spot in portal 2!

[–] Sonotsugipaa@lemmy.dbzer0.com 21 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

Two, if you count... the big one at the end

[–] lime@feddit.nu 10 points 6 hours ago (2 children)

it doesn't look like it's moving though. and considering how many things in portal 2 move when they look stationary or vice versa...

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[–] ThatWeirdGuy1001@lemmy.world 18 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

So the cube is just smashed?

It's a practical answer which is slightly upsetting because I wanted more discourse.

[–] kkj@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 4 minutes ago* (last edited 4 minutes ago)

No, cubes cannot be destroyed by crushing. The portal disappears when the surface starts moving and then the cube stops the surface's descent.

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[–] NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

The "ragebait answers only" in the OP is the only thing stopping me from actually raging at everyone saying A. I am giving them all the benefit of the doubt, they're deliberately saying the wrong answer.

Everyone saying B missed the assignment and answered accurately.

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[–] HailHydra@infosec.pub 5 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago)
[–] Tar_alcaran@sh.itjust.works 24 points 7 hours ago (2 children)

Option B. Portals already break a couple of laws of physics and can reverse entropy, but I like to think you should look at the speed of an object relative to the portal.

[–] min@lemmy.sdf.org 1 points 1 hour ago

What if the blue portal is at the bottom of the Marianas Trench?

[–] toiletobserver@lemmy.world 11 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

Speedy thing go in, speedy thing come out. Clearly explained in game.

[–] rethnor@lemmy.zip 8 points 5 hours ago* (last edited 5 hours ago) (2 children)

But I'm this case the cube has no speed, the platform does, so it wouldn't just suddenly start moving.

[–] megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 hour ago

The cube does have a non zero speed, it just depends what frame of reference you are measuring it by.

[–] FishFace@piefed.social 2 points 2 hours ago

It has speed relative to the portal though. Everything has some speed because we're orbiting the sun, etc

[–] Sonotsugipaa@lemmy.dbzer0.com 27 points 7 hours ago (3 children)

According to a gravitationally accurate simulation a guy did for Youtube, the correct answer is_

... ah, ragebait answers only. Well, mission accomplished, probably >:3

[–] Equinox1289@sh.itjust.works 21 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago)

For anyone who doesn't know, Optozorax on YouTube has made a finite element analysis simulation of gravity ontop of his portal simulation so we can get an answer to the question. The answer is both. Both happen depending on how fast the portal is moving and the where the second portal is placed in the gravity well.

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[–] luthis@lemmy.nz 13 points 6 hours ago (2 children)

Speedy thing goes in, speedy thing comes out.

Cube had no speed going in, therefore no speed going out. The portal speed is irrelevant

[–] FishFace@piefed.social 2 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

The cube has a speed of about 30km/s around the sun. You want to measure speed relative to the blue portal, but why that one and not the orange one?

[–] megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 hour ago

And if the blue portal is at a different angle than the orange portal, then… well, how fast is the milky way traveling through the galaxy relative to the universe?

[–] untorquer@quokk.au 2 points 4 hours ago

But reference frame changes as the cube passes through the portal. The piston would feel resistance as its momentum is transferred to the cube to conserve it.

[–] kek_kecske_31@lemmy.world 12 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 7 hours ago)

All "moving" makes sense only relative to a frame. As there is no absolute frame, for all discussions one need to choose one. It seems that any other frame than the one fixed to the enter portal is arbitrary. How do you distinguish a moving portal from everything else moving around it? Thus the only canonical answer seems to be you preserve the relative speed versus the enter portal as the speed relative to the exit portal. (B)

[–] empireOfLove2@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 6 hours ago

A. Object momentum relative to the world is retained thru portals regardless of the speed of the portal surface or the portal itself. The portal is only transmitting matter from A to B, it does not impart energy of any kind.

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