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Have you guys seen this stupid restaurant discourse that's making rounds on left twitter? (hexbear.net)
submitted 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) by Anemasta@hexbear.net to c/the_dunk_tank@hexbear.net
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https://twitter.com/Arbeit_Fish/status/1530502689913810945

It's genuinely baffling to me. What do those people think socialism is? I thought they were anprims or something, but no, that's something else.

Like how does a complex society supposed to work if something as simple as having to make a dinner for fellow workers is categorically considered exploitation?

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[–] Deadend@hexbear.net 1 points 3 years ago

Sorry, but I’m against socialism if there will be no more Charles Entertainment Cheese.

[–] TreadOnMe@hexbear.net 1 points 3 years ago

Idk, I loved customer service, I just hated having to pretend to do stuff when we were done stocking, and not being able to listen to my own music and podcasts even though I would have just turned it off if a customer needed something, but this whole 'customer is always right' mentality is toxic af to any sort of retail environment.

[–] Judge_Juche@hexbear.net 0 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) (2 children)

This whole discourse is just American leftists growing up so propaganized they don't even bother to look up what the acutal socialist states did, so they invent a socialist state from first principles. Which just means inventing a state that conforms to all of their own particular biases and grievances.

Like the Soviets were setting up communal cafeterias before the October Revolution, and they were so popular many survived the fall of the Soviet Union and continued to operate.

Also, the two oldest Peking Duck resturants in Beijing have been operating for like 500 years. Like the Red Guards came in and removed their old Imperial signage during the Cultural Revolution but no one objected to the idea of having the resturants themselves.

[–] Ho_Chi_Chungus@hexbear.net 1 points 3 years ago

Also, the two oldest Peking Duck resturants in Beijing have been operating for like 500 years. Like the Red Guards came in and removed their old Imperial signage during the Cultural Revolution but no one objected to the idea of having the resturants themselves.

Are those places still kicking? I'd love to eat at a restaurant older than most countries

[–] star_wraith@hexbear.net 0 points 3 years ago (1 children)

they don’t even bother to look up what the acutal socialist states did, so they invent a socialist state from first principles

I feel this is true for pretty much all Americans other than commies.

Like the Soviets were setting up communal cafeterias before the October Revolution

God I love this so much. In my dream socialist society, few people have or even want personal kitchens, just everyone in the community hang out at meal times and just vibes together.

[–] Poison_Ivy@hexbear.net 1 points 3 years ago

But I like cooking my own meals...

[–] dead@hexbear.net 0 points 3 years ago (2 children)

Without knowing all of the context of the screenshot, I think yall are just not agreeing about what a restaurant is. Is a restaurant just a designated place where a bunch of people eat together or is a restaurant a business that purchases labor to produce food in the commodity form ie for profit? Is a soup kitchen a restaurant? Is a prison cafeteria a restaurant? Is a neighborhood barbecue a restaurant? Is a communal kitchen a restaurant?

If we abolish the commodity form and wage labor, is the place where people go to eat prepared food still called a restaurant? I don't think it matters.

anyway here's Kropotkin

We can see perfectly well that it would be more economical to cook broth for a hundred families at once, instead of lighting a hundred separate fires. We know, besides, that there are a thousand ways of doing up potatoes, but that cooked in one huge pot for a hundred families they would be just as good.

We know, in fact, that variety in cooking being a matter of the seasoning introduced by each cook or housewife, the cooking together of a hundred weight of potatoes would not prevent each cook or housewife from dressing and serving them in any way she pleased. And we know that stock made from meat can be converted into a hundred different soups to suit a hundred different tastes.

But though we are quite aware of all these facts, we still maintain that no one has a right to force the housewife to take her potatoes from the communal kitchen ready cooked if she prefers to cook them herself in her own pot on her own fire. And, above all, we should wish each one to be free to take his meals with his family, or with his friends, or even in a restaurant, if so it seemed good to him.

Naturally large public kitchens will spring up to take the place of the restaurants, where people are poisoned nowadays. Already the Parisian housewife gets the stock for her soup from the butcher and transforms it into whatever soup she likes, and London housekeepers know that they can have a joint roasted, or an apple or rhubarb tart baked at the baker’s for a trifling sum, thus economizing time and fuel. And when the communal kitchen — the common bakehouse of the future — is established, and people can get their food cooked without the risk of being cheated or poisoned, the custom will no doubt become general of going to the communal kitchen for the fundamental parts of the meal, leaving the last touches to be added as individual taste shall suggest.

[–] Dangitbobby@hexbear.net 1 points 3 years ago

Usually it's called a "canteen". You need a meal ticket to enter. The ticket is issued by the government.

A restaurant is a place with a serving staff, where you order what you want from their menu and then out it comes.

I've eaten at both. A canteen can get dull after a while. Sure the food is different but it is same old, same old. Even the smell of the place when you enter can kill your appetite.

I was on a weeklong business trip to another country that turned into a month. By the second week I was so sick of eating out at restaurants for every meal. I don't want a full plate for breakfast, I just want some damn milk and cereal. Is that so hard?

[–] berrytopylus@hexbear.net 1 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago)

I get the idea but potatoes aren't just about seasoning. French fries vs baked potatoes vs potato chips are all cooked up in different ways.

No offense to Kropotkin but he's from a time where mass famine was still a major concern even in the imperialist nations and also a time when food was just kinda shitty compared to now.

[–] Sickos@hexbear.net 0 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) (1 children)

Restaurants as they exist now sure as hell better not exist under my fully automated luxury gay space communism, but they will sure as hell exist. Cooking is fun. Cooking for other people is fun. Cooking in a restaurant, and even FOH in one would probably be fun as hell if it weren't for the capitalist power dynamics at play.

~~They're upset that they wouldn't be able to shit on minimum wage workers anymore.~~

[–] Sickos@hexbear.net 0 points 3 years ago (1 children)

Did the lib thing of not checking context first. The argument presented is essentially that no one wants to be a wage slave, which is true. They just can't imagine a better version of things.

I pity the :LIB:

[–] Sickos@hexbear.net 0 points 3 years ago (1 children)

Wait, I dug further into the twitterer, and now I'm seeing them say anarchists need to read Marx? And that succdems are just libs? I am very, very confused.

Gonna just assume they're a very good wrecker and shut off the part of my brain that cares about tweeters' political stances (at least until the next post)

[–] KollontaiWasRight@hexbear.net 0 points 3 years ago (1 children)

Folks are having a stupid circle-jerk here and ignoring that there's actually a developed literature on the question of restaurants that is relevant to this discussion. The tweeter isn't wrecking anything. This entire post is just silly campist dunking on an ancom.

[–] Sickos@hexbear.net 0 points 3 years ago (1 children)

I'm up for more theory, what do you suggest?